[p2pu-dev] UI commentary for new design

John Britton public at johndbritton.com
Fri Jan 28 20:09:59 UTC 2011


@Joao - You've sort of been the de-facto UI/UX dude on P2PU. Thanks for
running point on that stuff, going forward is it ok if we defer
organizational stuff and new contributors for UI/UX to you? I'd like to know
what to do when people ask about helping with the design.

Cheers,
John Britton
--
contact info:
http://www.johndbritton.com
@johndbritton - http://twitter.com/johndbritton


On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 3:00 PM, B. Maura Townsend <jauncourt at gmail.com>wrote:

> Yes, please send me the link. I'd love to be able to have the ability
> to get in on the work.
>
> BMT
>
> 2011/1/28 João Antonio de Menezes Neto <tonyhomes at gmail.com>:
> > Maura andf everyone who might want to get involved in the designs could
> > really help us out in the Course Home layout - as it's one of the most
> > complex parts of the system.
> > Please ping me if want want to help and I'll give you the Dropbox link to
> > the editable files.
> >
> > João
> >
> > 2011/1/28 John Britton <public at johndbritton.com>
> >>
> >> +1 Github issues queue.
> >> The design was made by Aleks and Joao with input from the community and
> we
> >> decided to move on implementing it in it's current state because it is
> good
> >> 'enough' and a huge improvement from what we currently have. I
> definitely
> >> agree with Stian, we're not dead set on keeping the design this way
> forever.
> >> We're currently working on cutting the design and putting the code out
> there
> >> for people to help with.
> >> I'm also struggling to get new people involved more efficiently, it's
> not
> >> easy to get people up to speed on everything. We really appreciate the
> input
> >> and want you here!
> >> Cheers,
> >> John Britton
> >> --
> >> contact info:
> >> http://www.johndbritton.com
> >> @johndbritton - http://twitter.com/johndbritton
> >>
> >>
> >> 2011/1/28 João Antonio de Menezes Neto <tonyhomes at gmail.com>
> >>>
> >>> Hello again Maura,
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for sharing your opinion with us. As Becca commented, we're
> >>> volunteers for the love of it, and full-time dedication (unfortunately)
> >>> isn't possible. I'm the one who told you that these issues "were
> already
> >>> solved" because we had a specific discussion about contrast in the
> designs a
> >>> month ago, and we defined some changes (having the background as #555
> >>> instead of #333, for instance). I demoed this alteration in a .PNG file
> you
> >>> can find browsing our old Google Dev Group.
> >>>
> >>> I'd just ask you some patience in this question as Brian Brennan has
> >>> finished the HTML/CSS not even a week ago; so, as Stian commented,
> there are
> >>> a lot of improvements to come. I'm a Visual Designer myself and I'd
> really
> >>> love to work more with you on the new version of the site.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> []'s
> >>> João
> >>>
> >>> 2011/1/28 B. Maura Townsend <jauncourt at gmail.com>
> >>>>
> >>>> Unfortunately, this is about the third invitation to participate that
> >>>> I've received. :) I am participating, but I think it's getting lost.
> >>>>
> >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/p2pu-dev/JgsFkDaZIIs/discussion is
> >>>> where I wrote about issues with the current site and was invited to
> >>>> weigh in on the UI design and accessibility/usability (two different
> >>>> but related issues). When I did that though, I got a sort of brush off
> >>>> message indicating that what I was saying was seen as "already
> >>>> implemented." See comments:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> http://wiki.p2pu.org/w/page/32426155/New+website+design+(after-Techsprint)
> >>>>
> >>>> Also, I've been trying to find where to log reviews of design issues,
> >>>> or discuss them, but everything so far seems code related, and not at
> >>>> all UI related. I can't seem to find any discussion of the UI or look
> >>>> & feel. Searching chatlogs and this list (both versions) brings me up
> >>>> empty, no matter how I phrase it.
> >>>>
> >>>> Perhaps part of the problem is that I am not a coder, really, at all.
> >>>> I'm a visual designer with human factors experience. That's the POV I
> >>>> can bring to this, but it seems there is nowhere to put it.
> >>>>
> >>>> BMT
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 9:29 AM, Rebecca Kahn <bekka.kahn at gmail.com>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>> > Hi BMT
> >>>> >
> >>>> > I'm not really knowledgeable enough to comment on the UI issues you
> >>>> > raise,
> >>>> > but I might be able to give some clarity on your concerns about
> where
> >>>> > to
> >>>> > post these ideas and the fact that you've received very little
> >>>> > feedback.
> >>>> >
> >>>> > P2PU is, at the very heart of things, a community built on
> >>>> > give-and-take;
> >>>> > the vast majority of people are volunteers, and the only way the
> >>>> > community
> >>>> > and the project can survive is because amazing people put in as much
> >>>> > time
> >>>> > and effort as they can.
> >>>> >
> >>>> > We do have a small group of committed volunteers working on the UI.
> >>>> > But they
> >>>> > are all volunteers, and doing this in their spare time, out of
> passion
> >>>> > for
> >>>> > the project. From your mail, I suspect that you might be willing to
> >>>> > help out
> >>>> > in this way as well, and we'd like to welcome you to the community,
> >>>> > and
> >>>> > thank you for your effort and enthusiasm so far.
> >>>> >
> >>>> > As a group that is principally volunteer-driven, we've found that
> the
> >>>> > community tend to respond to issues that they feel most strongly
> about
> >>>> > - so
> >>>> > a small group of people might cluster around a certain issue, offer
> to
> >>>> > help
> >>>> > out with any fixes or tasks, and generally get things done that way.
> >>>> > It's a
> >>>> > sort of "group filter" that ensures that issues that the community
> >>>> > feel are
> >>>> > most pressing get tended to first. Operating on the principle of
> rough
> >>>> > consensus (ie: not everyone will always agree, but those who do have
> >>>> > opinions will pipe up, and decisions are made by those who care) we
> >>>> > tend to
> >>>> > also take slightly longer to get to issues than might otherwise
> happen
> >>>> > in a
> >>>> > bigger, more commercially oriented organisation.
> >>>> >
> >>>> > We do have some developers who are paid for their time and work, but
> >>>> > they
> >>>> > generally operate on the basis of x amount of hours per month, and
> >>>> > tend to
> >>>> > triage the really urgent issues, and when their time is up every
> >>>> > month, they
> >>>> > step back, and any issues left will be dealt with in the following
> >>>> > month.
> >>>> > Needless to say, with the launch of the courses, this month has been
> >>>> > really
> >>>> > busy.  I think it's also fair to say that we're all a bit stunned by
> >>>> > the
> >>>> > volume of response we've had this cycle, and are trying (not always
> >>>> > successfully) to keep up with it.
> >>>> >
> >>>> > Generally, people who have skills are happy to devote some of their
> >>>> > time and
> >>>> > the community is often a conduit for this, so if people ask for
> help,
> >>>> > those
> >>>> > who can contribute generally will do so. The dev list is a good
> place
> >>>> > to ask
> >>>> > for this kind of support.
> >>>> >
> >>>> > I suppose what I'm getting at is this: if you and any other people
> in
> >>>> > the
> >>>> > community are concerned about the UI, and have the skills, time or
> >>>> > inclination to help out with this, it would be wonderful. Please
> don't
> >>>> > take
> >>>> > the lack of response as an indication that nobody cares - I think
> >>>> > everyone
> >>>> > is just busy filtering the large amount of mail coming through at
> the
> >>>> > moment, and people who do share your concerns will come forward, if
> >>>> > you ask
> >>>> > for specific help with stuff. Jump in, and get your feet wet!
> >>>> >
> >>>> > We haven't been very good at communicating the reciprocal nature of
> >>>> > P2PU to
> >>>> > everyone who joins the community, but we do hope that people
> >>>> > understand this
> >>>> > dynamic and appreciate that it is all part of the great experiment
> >>>> > that is
> >>>> > P2PU! Most of the time, we just try stuff out and see if it works.
> >>>> > Sometimes
> >>>> > we get lucky and it does.
> >>>> >
> >>>> > I hope this answers some of your questions - and please don't be
> >>>> > discouraged
> >>>> > - the more people in the community who care about the project the
> >>>> > better.
> >>>> > Also, I'd love to hear what other people on this list think about
> this
> >>>> >
> >>>> > All the best
> >>>> > Bekka
> >>>> >
> >>>> >
> >>>> > On 28 January 2011 16:59, B. Maura Townsend <jauncourt at gmail.com>
> >>>> > wrote:
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> I put a comment on the new mockup seen at
> http://p2pu.brianloves.it/
> >>>> >> in the wiki, under the new design's page, and it seems that it's
> not
> >>>> >> really the best place to discuss UI issues, as I got brushed off.
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> My first comment was this (I was keeping it short because of the
> >>>> >> venue):
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> "Can we try for better contrast in the menus? Also, perhaps
> swapping
> >>>> >> the background color and text color when highlighted would be
> better,
> >>>> >> usability-wise."
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> Unfortunately, this was interpreted as being reference to the
> severe
> >>>> >> contrast issues that I and a number of others have noticed with the
> >>>> >> current site's styles.
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> A more in-depth analysis of the contrast issues with the current
> >>>> >> revision of the new design mockup :
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> "The higher contrast of the black pinstripe texture against the
> white
> >>>> >> background draws the eye away from the lower contrast menuing, even
> >>>> >> if
> >>>> >> it is not negatively affecting the main content. Would it be
> possible
> >>>> >> to make the black pinstripe lower contrast? Perhaps a gray about
> the
> >>>> >> current color of the un-highlighted menu text? That would increase
> >>>> >> the
> >>>> >> usability without lowering the overall visual impact.
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> "The menus at the top are fairly low contrast, light bluish gray
> >>>> >> against white, with the eye drawn away by the high-contrast
> >>>> >> background.The highlight is good, with decent contrast, though I'm
> >>>> >> worried about accessibility for colorblind users. The text in this
> >>>> >> menu should really be at least as dark a gray as the text in the
> >>>> >> captions shown in the main content areas.
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> "The menus at the bottom are low contrast unless highlighted,
> medium
> >>>> >> gray on medium-luminance colors. The highlight is so subtle as to
> be
> >>>> >> lost on many viewers. I'd propose making the text darker on these
> >>>> >> menus and making the highlight a swap of text and background color.
> I
> >>>> >> realize that this is the same shade as the dark gray in the content
> >>>> >> areas, but that is negated by the medium-luminance background color
> >>>> >> bars."
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> I'm concerned that I may not be commenting in the correct venue. Is
> >>>> >> there a UI design team? Is there a specific venue for discussion of
> >>>> >> the new UI? I know there isn't really anyone looking at usability
> >>>> >> besides myself and one or two others, and I've seen no comments
> from
> >>>> >> them.
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> Thanks,
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> BMT
> >>>> >> _______________________________________________
> >>>> >> p2pu-dev mailing list
> >>>> >> p2pu-dev at lists.p2pu.org
> >>>> >> http://lists.p2pu.org/mailman/listinfo/p2pu-dev
> >>>> >
> >>>> >
> >>>> >
> >>>> > --
> >>>> > Rebecca Kahn
> >>>> > Skype: rebekahn
> >>>> >
> >>>> >
> >>>> > _______________________________________________
> >>>> > p2pu-dev mailing list
> >>>> > p2pu-dev at lists.p2pu.org
> >>>> > http://lists.p2pu.org/mailman/listinfo/p2pu-dev
> >>>> >
> >>>> >
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> p2pu-dev mailing list
> >>>> p2pu-dev at lists.p2pu.org
> >>>> http://lists.p2pu.org/mailman/listinfo/p2pu-dev
> >>>
> >>>
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> >>>
> >>
> >>
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> >>
> >
> >
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